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O/SEO/O™ E8: Opinions About International SEO

Published on: 
June 16, 2022
Updated on: 
June 18, 2022
by
Tory Gray
Tory Gray
Sam Torres
Sam Torres
Begüm Kaya
Begüm Kaya

Thanks for joining us for another wonderful episode of Opinionated SEO Opinions™, along with special guest Nadia Mojahed! We're back with opinions about International SEO - everything from keyword research to translation prioritization and successful market *exits*.

Welcome to another episode of Opinionated SEO Opinions, where the international team at The Gray Dot Company addresses International SEO challenges with Nadia Mojahed.

Nadia is digital SEO consultant based in Geneva, Switzerland who has a diverse background in the industry. Having experienced different fields from WordPress web development to brand marketing to international SEO and more, she joined us to shed light on how she approaches international SEO challenges. Make sure to check out Nadia on Twitter.

Here's what we're covering today: 

  • 3:03 What are practical ways to approach budget & prioritization for translation projects with multiple languages?
  • 7:02 How to prioritize content optimization across languages with a limited budget?
  • 10:28 How do you approach a client that wants to scale content to a tremendous amount of languages without the proper trans-creation, curation and budget? Or how do you convince them otherwise?
  • 15:55 How to approach localizing keyword research for small countries with limited search volume, especially in niche fields?
  • 21:13 What are your recommendations for successfully exiting an international market?

Since we have amazing stuff cooking up in the kitchen, make sure to submit your #SEOquestions to https://thegray.company/ask-seo-questions

You can find your hosts here:
Tory Gray

Sam Torres

Begüm Kaya
Follow TGDC on LinkedIn and Twitter.

Video Transcript

Begüm Kaya  00:07
Hello, everyone. Welcome to another episode of Opinionated SEO Opinions™ and this time we are together with someone I was lucky enough to catch at Brighton SEO this April. We are here with Nadia Mojahed to discuss everything international SEO. Welcome, Nadia!

Nadia  00:26
Thank you so much for having me today, and hello, everyone. I'm glad to be collaborating together with Tory, Sam and Begüm. And yeah, I'm excited to share some tips and challenges that I face and learnings, when it comes to particular topics around international SEO.

Nadia  00:47
To introduce myself for those who don't know me—I am a digital and SEO consultant. So I've been working in the digital marketing field since more than 13 years. I've written the different marketing/digital marketing sides, whether like Google AdWords, social media, email marketing, web development, WordPress development. But then I wanted to really specialize in SEO because I really loved it. And actually, since three years, I'm working independently, and I had also the pleasure to collaborate with the Gray Company on very interesting projects. I handle international websites, and yeah, various sectors—whether SaaS, FinTech, legal, governmental website, eCommerce, you name it. And yeah, so I originally come from Jordan, and that's why my mother tongue is Arabic. And yeah, I speak good German and good French as I live in Switzerland, so yeah.

Tory Gray  02:03
Very cool. We are so lucky to get to collaborate with you and have you join us today. Thank you.

Nadia  02:09
Thank you, Tory.  It's always a pleasure.

Begüm Kaya  02:11
We have our hosts Tory Gray and Sam Torres from The Gray Dot Company as always. Hello, to you two. Hope you're all doing well.

Sam Torres  02:19
It's Monday (woohoo!).

Begüm Kaya  02:23
Whether it's probably not going to be published on another Monday.

Begüm Kaya  02:25
Probably not going to be published on a Monday, but just so y'all know, we're recording on a Monday. Soooooo. It's fine.

The "This is Fine" meme - cartoon dog sitting in a room, drinking coffee, surrounded by fire, saying "This is fine."
This is fine.

Begüm Kaya  02:30
Yes. That's our amazing fun activity to do on Mondays that is going to... motivate us to look forward to Mondays.

Sam Torres  02:39
Yes, yes. That. Yes.

Begüm Kaya  02:41
Get yourself something like this, everyone. Yeah. So it's like an additional tip to this episode is to have something fun to do on Mondays, for your sake, and like mental health at work? Yes, I'm sure Nadia has some bits that are going to further motivate us for Mondays. So shall we get started?

Sam Torres  03:00
Let's do it.

Question #1

What are practical ways to approach budget & prioritization for translation projects with multiple languages?

Begüm Kaya  03:02
Yay. So the first question would be: Nadia—what are practical ways to approach budget and prioritization for translation projects with multiple languages?

Nadia  03:12
I found actually, that it's useful to take the translation project, step by step. So many clients think of a translation in terms of having this content and then sending it to a translator and then receiving back the piece of content and then verifying if that falls within the context like checking if the translation went correct or not. But actually, there are also, I mean, not saying that this is a wrong way, or they shouldn't do that,  but there are also other practical ways to make the translation more efficient, especially like when you have content optimization, as well included.

Nadia  04:01
So what I follow actually, as a process for translating a content, especially when we have different language variations... Here in Switzerland, we have like some companies really, basically target six languages at the same time. So what I do is that I rely actually as a first step on Google Translate, to have just like the basic version of the content.

Nadia  04:32
And within that content, I integrate the keywords that are planned in the AI structure of the website, to make sure that those keywords are not replaced and are not translated. I highlight them in the Word document and then I share them with a local speaker in order to proofread the content and use the terms that we can change, that we are not like we're not  targeting as a keywords because sometimes it's good to target different keywords that are very specific to the local language as well that is used generally within that language. So not to miss for keyword opportunities, especially the topics are new to the market or people are used to search with, yeah, with generic, like a non-typically very local keywords.

Nadia  04:35
I find that very much more time efficient to do the basic setup to prepare the content for translate for like content proofreading, rather than a translator translating, when we're not talking about REALLY niche—niche topic or like when the topics are about the normal sports, lifestyle, home, eCommerce websites.

Nadia  06:01
When it comes to very niche medical websites, or maybe legal websites, etc, then part of it would could work but you need as well to integrate, you need to know the language in order to know, like, when you do this translation to verify to read quickly before doing the proofreading, and before like going into details.  You need to know the language in general in order to see if that is going {to be} within the context or not, and of course, then the person, the local person who proofreads is good as well. It's very important if you want to approach this process to have them as well speaking English so that they understand as well, what's the context in English. So that also makes—yeah, having a better quality for the translation and reducing the time and iteration going back and forward and maintaining the keywords as well within the text.

Question #2

How to prioritize content optimization across languages with a limited budget?

Tory Gray  07:03
When those projects are budget limited? I've heard you speak a little bit about how to prioritize across languages. How have you approached that before?

Nadia  07:14
Basically, I do some research beforehand, because for clients, they don't know that—which language, what's the opportunity for their website, and which language that drives them better clicks or, or impressions. I find it very useful to do this keyword research beforehand, not necessarily following keyword volumes– because as many of us know that, especially in small market like Switzerland, there are no search volumes.

Nadia  07:52
Switzerland has four languages, and it's—Google doesn't show search volumes for those little volumes of keywords. Also in business to business, we cannot rely really on search volumes for keywords. So basically, how relevant and popular the topic is through the keywords that Google suggests on the—on SERPs on result pages. How many keyword variations for example, in Google Keyword Planner. How many keyword variations related to the topic. Are there so many, even if they are zero to 10? Social media is very, very important resource to see like—the popular topics, the trends are going there, and as well Google Search Console, because it gives like good information if the website is already published.

Nadia  08:49
What would you think Tory? Like, do you have like any thoughts on that as well?

Tory Gray  08:56
I think that makes sense. I mean, what I'm hearing is you're using search market research to really vet the size of the market. And that helps you determine, you know—by language, by region—where to go forward. And where you're limited by third party search volume data then you're relying on some of these other tools, which I think leads us into our next question. So I think that makes a tremendous amount of sense to me. Any other additions?

Begüm Kaya  09:24
I think it's wonderful that you're taking... oh sorry, Sam. It's amazing that you're taking a look at like multiple data sources and you're trying to get all the value out of there.

Begüm Kaya  09:37
And I think when it comes to that the market saturation is very important too. So for different languages and Swiss market for example, I think it can be a good opportunity to take a look at the competitors and see what they're going after and also even aggregators, sometimes they just go after very niche and longtail keywords to get all the companies, for example for B2B—just list out all the companies that are working in that field, etc. So, yeah, using everything that you can from the SERPs, and I think we all waste—put emphasis on how important SERP and competitor analysis is. So this is another point that it comes very important and handy.

Sam Torres  10:14
Yeah. Um, so first I've, as you know, someone who has worked really only in the States, and we've worked with international clients, but most of the time—probably what, 95% of the time our clients are working in English?

Question #3

How do you approach a client that wants to scale content to a tremendous amount of languages without the proper trans-creation, curation and budget? Or how do you convince them otherwise?

Sam Torres  10:28
Really interesting to hear about the different search volumes across, you know—really just different markets and how search volume is almost not applicable or not, not relevant information. So kind of love that. And also I wonder, how would you approach—so I think we've probably all had it: where the clients really want to go ahead and spam to like 150 languages, and they're not going to take the time, or put together the budget to have some custom curation.

Sam Torres  10:59
What are ways that you've kind of like, obviously... we all know that can be a PR nightmare, right? You might say something completely inappropriate, and not realize it! And do you have any steps or tricks on, you know, how do you scale that? How do you try to be responsible about it when your hands are really tied, and you're gonna have to do it anyways? Which is awful, by the way. Please, companies, don't do that!

Tory Gray  11:22
Or how do you convince them otherwise?

Sam Torres  11:24
Yeah.

Tory Gray  11:26
When that happens to you, Nadia, what do you do?

Nadia  11:30
I mean, I always make sure to pass the content to—like I always push to have, like, local speakers checking the content, I don't let content be posted. Or like, when I worked with, with companies at the beginning, I see that they just like apply, you know, like those plugins to translate. And then I, that's one of the topics that I start with them, when we are signing the contract. That we need to just check those kinds of content, because it's so hard for me to take responsibility about the SEO project, when there are like, different variation of content languages that are posted without checking them. So I can't be responsible about them.

Tory Gray  12:22
Yeah, that is actually super interesting, because it sounds almost like you know, whereas we come with a relatively privileged background being mostly based in the US having a large search volume overall. And, you know, English-speaking companies moving into other regions—and just wanting it to magically work and put it up as a bunch of languages.

Tory Gray  12:42
Whereas you're based in a small country that has four languages. So they already know they can't get away with that. Because they have to speak to those four different people. And that is their target market. So, it'll be interesting as internationalization continues, just to see, I don't know—failed expansions, and what happens in terms of companies falling down. Especially the the US-based variety that try and pull that crap, and just keep not succeeding, because it becomes more what, competitive because the international markets are stepping it up in ways that the companies don't always over here. Some do, some definitely do.

Sam Torres  13:26
But I like your call out of basically just—setting expectations and almost having it like, and maybe you have it in the contract, maybe you don't, but just almost having the written expressed—like, it's not your responsibility, if they're not going to take your advice, or they're not going to take your expertise. I think that's something, especially as SEO consultants or agencies, we can probably do more of, of just like I say, setting those expectations and being really clear of like, "Hey, this is in my control and this is not." And I think this is definitely one of those areas where that's really important.

Nadia  14:00
Yeah, I'm usually actually... companies sometimes it just like—it's an additional process that they need to add to their process. So they, they usually, they don't want to do it. But then if, when I offer to do it part of the service, but they need to agree that this has to be implemented, then they agree [sic] on on on... taking that.  

Nadia  14:23
Because it's just like, "Oh, how are we going to be looking? Who's going to be responsible from the team on researching for local content. Proofread: WHEN to do it, before and after?"  But offering that part of the service and including it and just like agreeing that they are willing to change that or adapt that help, as well.

Nadia  14:49
It's very important that that clients, for me, know that not every piece of content needs to be optimized in terms of SEO. So there are some pages that are [more] important than this language versus others that are more important that need to be optimized. So if we have a limited budget to be more efficient, then we can say that we agree to optimize, let's say, 10 pages.  For those 10 pages that can be different language variations, and we don't need to optimize like every page.

Nadia  15:21
Translation and proofreading by local language speakers are always important, because then you need the translation, when you have the link, you need the different variations/translations. But when it comes to optimization, it's not like translation that you need to optimize every page. So based on the market research like that, based on the user needs, and yeah, the, the, yeah—the user needs, then we decide which language variations that we can, we can translate.

Question #4

How to approach localizing keyword research for small countries with limited search volume, especially in niche fields?

Begüm Kaya  15:55
Let's talk a little bit about how you approach localized keyword research for small countries with limited search volume, especially when it comes to niche fields, which makes everything harder.

Coming Soon: How to Work With Low- to No-Volume SEO Keywords

Nadia  16:07
It's basically—I go deeper into, like, different... checking different tools I use.  Definitely, just like for an introduction on the topics & the related topics, to see where the website stands, in terms of the digital presence. I check the the Google Search Console, I check the Google Keyword Planner, again, not for search volumes, because I don't rely on them.

Nadia  16:38
Because there are lots of—even like if there are high search volumes, but then they don't drive really traffic, or they don't answer users questions, then what's the use of them? So I really rely on Google Search Console. The different tools available, whether Keyword Planner, whether Google search itself, I rely on it a lot. The autocomplete, the top of the page, the relevant related keywords.  A tool that really helps with researching on SERPs is Keywords Everywhere. So it's just like speeds up the relevant keywords, relevant questions.

Nadia  17:19
Like "on the go", I find it very useful and it's very budget efficient as well. I conduct, actually, user reviews. So I interview users, or prospects or like audiences like I do—I prepared a few questions like following the user, UX experience, or UX design questions. I just prepare a few questions. And I just let users speak about their needs, about what are the needs—in their own terms.  Because usually and often companies talk about their services in terms of the solutions that they offer and not by the topics or words that users use. So I make sure to interview from, let's say, five to 10. Ten is better, or sometimes 15, if it's a very niche topic of users or target audiences to know better what their language is.

Nadia  18:26
Social media platforms provide very good insights as well on what are the topics and terms especially in like, if there are groups within the local community as well. Sometimes I put posts on social media. And I interact with, as well... like I call the company, the client services, I call them multiple times, just like to see what they... what they like, what are behind those services. So I just like ask, "Yeah, you offer the service, what does it mean?" So to get more like... ideas?

Nadia  19:02
So yeah, it requires maybe more time, but then the results—the results are actually much better. Even if the website, let's say, even if I'm optimizing for a market that has bigger search volumes, I still apply many of the process that I apply for lower search volumes, because I find it very, always very useful to do some user interviews, especially at the beginning of the project to know better about the the users and what's like, yeah, what to work on on the website.  That helps really give a better perspective about the project at hand.

Tory Gray  19:45
Yes, I would imagine it results in a lot more conversions for the business—if you really understand what's actually happening instead of simply relying on a third party tool and calling it good and moving on.

Sam Torres  19:57
Or especially identifying where... communication gaps maybe? I feel like that's that's a lot of, I think just kind of almost like, periphery benefits, that sometimes SEO provides. As you realize, like, "Hey, your sales team and the customer service team are not speaking the same language!", whether it's actually physically or you know, they're just using very different terms, or they're... they're framing things very differently, right? Um, so I love that you do that. And also love that you call it, it's, you know, part of the user experience really just getting to that UX. Because I agree, I think SEO is a huge part of UX and there's just so much we can learn from each other on that side. So... love it.

Begüm Kaya  20:41
Definitely, and it's amazing that you're taking that next step to really get the value out of the users and the persona, etc. It's like, here, Nadia, not many SEOs do that. So I really appreciate it.

Nadia  20:56
Thank you. I'm pleased to hear that. I really like—I really encourage SEOs to really, like, apply lots of user research within the process, because it's always rewarding to discover really—what really works. Yeah, and that's simply keywords.

Question #5

What are your recommendations for successfully exiting an international market?

Begüm Kaya  21:13
Internationalization and international markets come with their own challenges, and it's sometimes—companies believe that it's time to leave. So when it comes to the exit strategies, how do you successfully exit an international market?

Tory Gray  21:29
I can jump in here a little bit. And Nadia, would love to hear your perspective as well. So I think it's important to keep in mind when you're exiting an international market, that there's a lot of reasons why you'd exit the market. They can be SEO related, or they can be completely unrelated. You might not have customer service, you might have overextended yourself, there might be changes to the pricing for shipping, right?

Tory Gray  21:52
Actually, that leads me to another question. I'd be really curious if like—what the legalities are working with, because we work with a lot of compliance or legal teams, in order to make that... we just work in regulated industries a lot. So we therefore we work with compliance teams, and therefore working across countries would add an extra layer of complexity, right? So if there are any additions there, I'd be interested in hearing stories that you might have there, Nadia. Someone remind me to bring it back around to that question!

Tory Gray  22:23
But in terms of actually successfully exiting the market. So I've done this for a well-known beauty brand that you'd buy in any department store before. They had done the typical thing that companies do, historically, which is they just they got translations, they—and not even translations, they just you know popped up a top level domain version in like 12-ish different markets, I think?

Tory Gray  22:53
Some are English, some are French, German, all the the the typical places that a global beauty brand would want to go to. And, you know, it wasn't customized, it was not a great experience. Sometimes products weren't available in certain areas, it was just all-over just not as successful deploy. So it was time for this beauty brand to pull things back and restart. So you can think about the—you know, maximizing the SEO return on this change, or at least like minimizing the SEO pain of pulling back.

Tory Gray  23:29
But I also want to make sure that we think through the user implications of "you just stopped shipping to this market", or you didn't stop shopping to this market, but you stopped, you know, offering a dedicated language for them to be able to shop for their blush or mascara or whatever.

Tory Gray  23:47
They chose not really to focus on the the user perspective. So I'll focus on that first, which is a tool that I think is really vastly underutilized—is to build functionality with your engineering/ development teams to basically issue a—an interstitial. So it's sort of like a pop up, but it's in the screen, it's not separate. And it... or you know, one of those banners at the top of your screen that has messaging for the user to help them understand what happened. And you can trigger that based on the redirect source. If you can identify that, in you know the user logs, you can use like that referrer or... (Sorry I'm getting lots of text messages coming in. Go away!)

Tory Gray  24:32
You can use that to message to users exactly what happened. So I would consider strongly putting out a press release on your website, or something, that explains that you're exiting the market and you know, are you still helping those customers or not, you know.  There's messaging things you should do to communicate what happened and why.

Tory Gray  24:51
Then certain pages that get retired makes sense to redirect to that page, and then you can message that.  But sometime it makes sense that for Blush A and Blush B to just get consolidated and put back together, right? So if you issue that redirect—so instead of just sending them to the .com, explain what happened with that messaging, and you can always link to that page for more information. So the key is really just communicating with your user what happened, why, how it will impact them, or not. So that's definitely a tool I'd recommend.  

Tory Gray  25:27
In terms of actually just setting up the SEO pieces, I mean, that's really a matter of, frankly, 301 redirects.  Again, hopefully, with good messaging users—but just making sure you do the detailed mapping, to make sure they go to all the right places to consolidate "like" with "like"... doing a good job with that. That's my my general answer from an SEO perspective, obviously, there's other things involved, non-SEO and entering/exiting the market. But those are the things to think through.  

Tory Gray  25:57
Nadia, anything to add to that, or... ?

Nadia  26:00
Yeah, absolutely. It just, yeah, I just would like to add maybe, yeah, just like the timing to start.  Like, {a} couple of months ahead of time, and definitely yeah, to just like, make sure that everybody can see it, or more of a larger audience can, or website users can see it. Yeah, like, have coverage on that on the website as much as possible, where relevant, and as well, like, do it ahead of time to make sure everybody use it. And as you said Tory, as well to include other tools that help with SEO, like emails, like, yeah—like customer emails, or specific communication, if there is a call center to include it within the calls actually. Like, integrated into the other part of the, of the organization, or the company tools.

Sam Torres  27:02
Just some questions for y'all.  When a company has been exiting a market, you know normally, I think one of the natural questions that would come up from internal teams is: "Hey, how much of a hit are we going to take on our website? How much is traffic going to decrease? What would you predict?" You know, I think the obvious answer would be just look at what traffic is going to those pages or from that market, you know, obviously, you're going to lose that. How much impact have you typically seen in other pieces of the visibility, if any, at all?

Nadia  27:37
I have experienced an exit to the market once and the effect was actually, there was a drop, on the I mean, on the impressions and clicks but it has recovered within—for the other markets, I mean—it has recovered after a couple of months. So it wasn't that big, like, shock to the website. So the... the, the impressions and clicks were not that much for the, from that market that we exited from. And at the same time, it wasn't profitable business. So even if there were clicks and the word conversions happening, they were not... So what I'm trying to say is that—profitability also is one of the KPIs to put into account. And when it comes to the SEO, it went a little bit down, but then it recovered after a couple of months. So that was not really a big hit on on profitability at the at the end of the day.

Tory Gray  28:47
On my end, there was not much of a hit, but I think that was largely because it was never particularly helpful in the first place. They were mostly, you know, they were deploying and seeing if they could just maximize revenue through, you know, a low cost way to go international that didn't work. So it was just an effort that failed, that, you know, never took off, there wasn't a ya know....

Sam Torres  29:11
Shocking.  You have to put in effort! (Laughs)

Pick the right international SEO structure for your business, based on your needs & goals!

Tory Gray  29:15
Associated with suddenly trying to double or triple or quadruple your revenue... who knew? So consolidating that, if anything, was a benefit, especially in terms of the duplicate content nature of same-language content. So the different site for the UK and the different site for Australia, etc., like consolidating that no longer caused that problem. So you know, if anything, there were links from those areas that were now, you know, part of the main domain—so that that went well.

Sam Torres  29:51
Okay.  Very Cool.

Tory Gray  29:52
But yeah, just to Nadia's point, if you actually had traction in that market, that's going to be a lot more painful. And yeah, you should do your research to make sure you understand what that pain is going to be so the business is well prepared to—to handle it.

Sam Torres  30:07
Yeah, which we have seen those due to compliance or legal reasons, you have to remove yourself from a market, right, like government regulations have changed or import/export laws. And that is painful. So so painful, for so many reasons. So, yeah.

Tory Gray  30:25
Oh, and I thought of one more thing, in terms of exiting the market. So this, the original question how to exit an international market came from Women In Tech SEO, and the company, I believe, was based in the UK, and I think they were pulling out of an Australian market, I could be wrong about that. But they had been there a long time, they loved their customers there, they had really strong connections with them, so they really cared about that user experience.

Tory Gray  30:50
So we did chat through and talk through some opportunities to like... what do you do to help those users? Not only are you not—because in this case, they weren't shipping their physical products there anymore—what do you do to help those users? So some of the things we discussed as a solution could be... on that page where you message what's happening, you could, you know, if you have relationships with other vendors that you know, previous competitors that aren't competitors anymore, that you want to make sure you promote. They could help.

Tory Gray  31:19
You could promote them on your site, you could put affiliate links to your site, and link to them in order to, you know, open up a small new revenue stream—or big one, if those were customers that were meaningful, and were spending money—but you left for whatever legal reasons.

Tory Gray  31:19
What else did we discuss.... You know, there's—there's sometimes there's tools for people to get things shipped remotely. So if you have a credit card, and you can purchase in another country, some credit cards enable that, and some don't, obviously. So like, what are those providers that allow you to ship between one versus the other.

Tory Gray  31:24
I'm physically based in Canada now. And shipping things to Canada is actually rather complicated. And so there are services that help you set up like a P.O. Box in America, so I can get it shipped there. And then they can be the intermediary and send to me. So you could set up those kinds of solutions. You could offer these to your customers as like: "What are your workarounds to buy for me? Where do you buy in your local market? What are the good, actual good providers?" So again, think through the actual human impact of what you're doing, and how do you help those users. Because maybe things will change in the future and you want to go back, and you want to have not completely dropped the ball and screwed a bunch of people. So people remember stuff like that.

Sam Torres  32:40
For sure, maybe being thoughtful, will help them.

Begüm Kaya  32:43
I was just going to say that you left me wondering if like, getting a partnership with the marketplaces in that country would be an option.  Unless they are like withdrawing their products for legal reasons and compliance things from that country. So yeah, maybe that can be an option to promote their goods, too.

Tory Gray  33:03
Yeah I think this was more of like a—maybe a Brexit, or like they couldn't, but that doesn't mean everybody couldn't, right? So. But that's a great call out.

Sam Torres  33:11
Yeah, I will say though, unfortunately, I have seen when it comes to legal and compliance. Nadia, I know you mentioned, like, try to do planning at least a few months in advance. Unfortunately, if it's legal, usually marketing gets like a week heads up. So it can be a little bit of a scramble.

Sam Torres  33:28
Um, we'd love to hear what are your thoughts? Because, you know, we are talking about how we need to focus on the user, and we need to think about the human. And so I think, you know, for me, sometimes that does mean that kind of those rules or general guidelines that we would have for SEO, can sometimes be subverted, or just kind of throw them out for a little bit, because, again, it's thinking about that user first. So an example of one of those things, I'm thinking about—Tory, you were talking about setting up, you know, really the pages that communicate what has changed. So, you know, even is it a possibility that you would want to redirect to a page that explains and then has a client-base redirect instead of a server redirect or something like that. I think those experiences that are worth talking about.  Because SEO is so subjective, right? So where do you fall on that, that line?

Tory Gray  34:19
That's a great way to communicate, to lead. You can also think about your internal linking from the page that you create. So: what are you emphasizing? So if you're then redirecting it back to that main page and explaining it, you know, maybe they can still buy and ship from your site—but they can't, you know—[maybe] it's not necessarily in a different language, or it's just not localized like it used to be. You could still link to your key product categories or key product pages from there, and so all the link equity that's gone to this particular page then would get spread back into the site in that way. So being thoughtful about it, how to help them. But that would be much less helpful in the scenario in which you can't ship to them. So think about what can you do with that, and then maybe you don't get the SEO benefits of that internal linking, if you can't actually support that user, so it wouldn't matter in short anyway.

Sam Torres  35:19
I have seen one solution that I've really loved because, cases where it was like–they weren't allowed to advertise the product anymore in a certain market. So you could still have it available, but any of like the promotional or paid marketing had to stop. And so, and that included things like sale prices, those products were no longer eligible to be in the sale items. So one, one thing I really loved is, so the landing pages are the pages that were previously targeted at that market, and were localized to that market because there were some language switchers and all that good stuff. If you clicked into a product page we actually had—so I've seen it where we had an interstitial, which of course, usually were like, bad! Interstitials are bad—but this one, I feel like communicated a good, a needed message, right? It actually was relevant. So we did, we've done that, or we also have just like banners that show up on the product page. And so it's a little bit of dynamic serving, right, or programmatic. But that's definitely one of my favorite things I've seen, implemented, that we get to coach on and yes, think about that user.

Sam Torres  36:32
Nadia, what, what about your experiences?

Nadia  36:35
For me, I mean, the experience that I have been through was, the product was not profitable in that market. So it was like the costs were like higher than the profits. And what we did is that we have redirected the links from that specific version into the English version. And yes, that, that—that was a good solution for that, for that case.

Begüm Kaya  37:04
Thankful to hear for the company, though.

Sam Torres  37:09
What can you do? Yeah. What you can do is you hire Nadia to help you correctly exit the market.

Begüm Kaya  37:16
Yes. There you go.

Sam Torres  37:19
That's what you do.

Tory Gray  37:21
Or deploy there successfully in the first place. So you get enough sales so that it is profitable.

Nadia  37:28
Yes, maybe there are opportunities untapped or yeah, if it's, if it comes... if it's because of a profit loss or something related, that is not legal, as you mentioned, Tory.

Tory Gray  37:42
Yeah. All kinds of reasons.

Begüm Kaya  37:45
[I think it was our second episode that I was kind of bragging about how international we are, being from Canada, US and Turkey. And today, with internationalization for SEO, we became even more international. So thank you for joining us, Nadia. It was wonderful having you.

Nadia  38:03
I just wanted to say thank you very much.

Tory Gray  38:05
I wanted to also say thank you for coming and also say, make sure to submit your SEO questions to thegray.company/ask-seo-questions. We want to hear from you and answer those questions, so let us know what you want to hear from us.

Begüm Kaya  38:19
Yeah, and especially because we have certain things planned for the next episode in The Gray Dot Company. And yeah, we're going to be coming with another surprise guest and yeah, it's going to be as brilliant as this episode. We're looking forward to it already. Maybe we c be published on another Monday, right, Sam?

Sam Torres  38:44
Okay, we can do that. Yes.

Begüm Kaya  38:49
All right. Wonderful. Thanks for joining us, everyone.

Tory Gray  38:53
Thank you for coming to another episode of Opinionated SEO Opinions™.

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